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Old 27-05-2010, 12:16 AM
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Default What hooks cause I'm stumped.

As a newbie to fly tying and fishing I am rapidly becoming overwhelmed by the choices and variations available to me.

I am fine when it comes to the basic "standard" hook and tying flys on them but I've started looking into things like klinkhammers etc and now the flood gates have opened.

I did try a klink hammer by bending a normal hook with pliers to match the photos I used in a guide but what hooks should I be using when it comes to emergers, caddis etc. Should I be using the specific kinkhammer hooks or would other more general hooks such as buzzers etc do the same job.

Also why downturned, straight or up turned eyes?

And is the difference between a dry fly hook and a wet fly hook simply down to weight?

Been looking on ebay and various online shops but that just makes me dream about getting trapped under an avalanche of fly tying stuff. Seriously I have had this dream, it would have been a nightmare execpt I was actually quite happy to have so much stuff around me. I think that there may be a little magpie in my genes as I can't resist shiny, sparkly colourful things to do with fishing. This makes me a tackle shops best friend but my own worst enemy.



Ignorantly yours,
Bob.

Last edited by palindromic_bob; 27-05-2010 at 12:48 AM.
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Old 27-05-2010, 04:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by palindromic_bob View Post
I did try a klink hammer by bending a normal hook with pliers to match the photos
Oh no no!!!

Look carefully at hook catalogues by Kamasan, Partridge or Sparton. Contact a good hook supplier who will advise you. Join The Fly Dressers Guild and go along for a group session. Get a couple of books on the subject by people like Peter Gathercole or Steve Parton.
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Old 27-05-2010, 05:12 AM
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Hooks......Don't go there, as owner of several hundred thousand hooks It can assure you it is a fascinating world.

Up eyed hooks originated for dries in order to lift the "gut" off the waters surface and render it less visible to the fish. We now use modern nylons and flurocarbons that are invisible or sink so this is no longer such an issue. I no longer tie dries on up eyed hooks unless a client specifically asks for it.

Straight eyed hooks are less common. I use them for gold heads, streamer style flies and in saltwater.

Dry fly hooks are generally lighter in the wire and slightly longer than wet fly hooks of the the same size. This is for weight reasons as you supposed.
That said, with lightness comes inherent problems of weakness.

I now tie 90% of all my river dries in sizes 12 down to 22 on Partridge or Varivas dry fly hooks.
For reservoirs I use Fulling Mills "All purpose medium" as it is stronger while still being light enough to float a Hopper or Shipmans buzzer. The Fulling Mill all purpose dry is also a good hook but it is not as strong and I only use it for flies that I'm going to fish static as opposed to "pulling ".

Bending hooks with pliers is not a good idea. Steve Parton will give you a lecture on "temper" but in general if you can bend it then so can the fish! Add to that the possibility of breakage in use and its not worth it.
As an experiment put a few different hooks in the vice and test to destruction. Some will snap almost immediately you start to bend
These are brittle and will often be the ones that break in fishing.
Others will not shap at all and can be bent into a straight line. These are soft and can open out on fish.
Those are the two extremes, but show how much variation there can be between one manufacturers hooks and anothers.

Partridge Klinkhamer Extreme are just the job. They are factory bent to the correct shape. Just remember that their sizes are a bit odd. A size 16 KHE = a size 12 L/S dry fly hook in length and a size 14 in gape. I use mainly sizes 16 to 20

Buzzer hooks tend to be too curved for good klinks but are great for other types of emerger. Kamasan B100 is very popular although I don't use it.

If you want to encourage the magpie in you, please put a system in place before you start buying. As I said I have thousands of hooks..all the colours in all the sizes, but if my life depended on it I couldn't find most of them right away. I didnt organise from the start.

The advice from Ron is spot on. I'd seek out the local branch of the Fly Dressers guild, Check out www.the-fdg.org .

Hope this helps

Regards
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Last edited by Chris Reeves; 27-05-2010 at 05:21 AM. Reason: Added more information
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Old 27-05-2010, 05:26 AM
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I found the free Sportfish catalogue useful when choosing hooks. It has a couple of pages of fly hooks of all types (from pike and salmon to tiny dry fly) from different manufacturers.

If you don't already have one Sportfish will be happy to put you on their mailing list (google Sportfish winforton for their tel no).

Last edited by dogbloke; 27-05-2010 at 05:32 AM.
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Old 27-05-2010, 06:35 AM
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Hehe I thought the bent a hook with pliers would go down well . From getting the feel of the forum something tells me that it would have probably been more acceptable to swear

It was impatience that made me do it. Ordered some Kinkhammer extremes and a set of gallows last night as I was actually sucessful with tying it (first ever parachute) and it looks pretty neat. Don't intend on fishing the bent one because it just isn't quite right due to my ham fisted attempt at hook manipulation. The proper hooks also seem to have better visual cue on where I should be tying in materials etc.

Luckily I do tend to go through phases of being highly organized to times of organized chaos. Never takes too long to get organized again. I have a dedicated room for all my hobbies which makes it easier. Be in gaming, music or fishing I always have my fortress of solitude

Thanks for the advice so far guys.

Thanks for the FDG link. None near me but they have some nice patterns on pdf that I can carry on my iphone and contemplate at work.

Last edited by palindromic_bob; 27-05-2010 at 07:06 AM.
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Old 27-05-2010, 10:12 AM
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Not saying you are wrong but the original klinkhamer special actually called for a "bend your own" of the partridge GRS15ST if i remember correctly...
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Old 27-05-2010, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ickypimp View Post
Not saying you are wrong but the original klinkhamer special actually called for a "bend your own" of the partridge GRS15ST if i remember correctly...
I tie all my klinkies on a the Partridge hook that I bend myself. Done it hundreds of times, without a problem. Pertridge have introduced a specialist klinkie hook that is already bent, and it isn't bad. I don't have the model number with me, but I can post it when I get home
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Old 27-05-2010, 12:58 PM
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I too spent many a happy hour putting very small bends into hooks for Klinks, The reason we had to do this was that no hook patterns were available that did the job. The bottom line is that a tempered steel hook that is subsequently bent loses some of its strength. The bend required for a Klink in minimal and I've not had any problems with Partridge or Fulling Mill Living Larvae hooks. Now that there is a proper hook on the market I tend to use those and nothing else. Now If I can only convice Partridge to size them properly and make a real size 18 we'd be in business.

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Old 27-05-2010, 03:40 PM
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thread hijack................

why are klinkhamer hooks sizes so wrong?

they dont seem to relate to other hook sizes.
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Old 27-05-2010, 04:29 PM
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Hook sizes are arbitrary there is no defined standard... i bought a box of Grip 14723BL in a size 12, they are bloody massive...
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