Where has all the Chadwicks come from?

[A. Fluker]

GAC are now selling it in small packages. Essential Fly claim to have some and will be activating a survey on it and subs.

Where has it all come from?

[allanw]

477 was apparently developed for darning knickers torn on Highland gorse so maybe now all the 477 coloured Knickers have worn out there is a surplus of Darning wool

[noeyedeer]

There are already quite a few "threads" on this (LOL).

One of our members has a bulk spool he got from a factory too (that I have a sample of)

I have emailed Essential Fly about the dyestuff properties etc since if they are trying for a near to exact repro (which their websites suggests), modern dyestuffs may exhibit a variance regarding reflection/refraction.

Most of the other parameters (fibre fineness/staple length, yarn spec etc) should be able to be copied given they weren't that niche in the first place and sheep haven't evolved much in 40 yrs! The Nylon can be chemically defined and filamentation/fibre specified too.

They are stating they have a techncal advisor to help with this so it is heartening that someone is finally attempting to put this in to production.

(If they want some optical yarn quality clearers/cutters, dye machine controls, colour matching or recipe managment systems etc to assist with the job I'd be only to pleased to help BarcoVision textile quality systems - plug plug )

[dabhoy]

Originally Posted by Loopy

GAC are now selling it in small packages. Essential Fly claim to have some and will be activating a survey on it and subs.

Where has it all come from?

Now we know who has been buying all of it from Ebay

[greenock]

Originally Posted by allanw

477 was apparently developed for darning knickers torn on Highland gorse so maybe now all the 477 coloured Knickers have worn out there is a surplus of Darning wool

Wonder if their period knickers would make a good bloodworm.

[dabhoy]

Originally Posted by allanw

477 was apparently developed for darning knickers torn on Highland gorse so maybe now all the 477 coloured Knickers have worn out there is a surplus of Darning wool

Dont you know that hardy highlanders dont wear knickers

[Chris Reeves]

With regard to the sudden explosion of 477 onto the market, I was recently contacted out of the blue by a guy who works for Hillingdon council. He claimed to have bought out some stock from a closed down tackle shop (Judds?) (Thames Angling?) that had a "large" box full of 477 in a store room.
Now rather than sell it to me at a fixed price he asked me to make him an offer.

Before I was prepared to do that I spoke to a few people to see if this was a genuine offer, including Phil Holding at Spiders Plus. Phil told me he had also been contacted and had bought one of the cards and that it was the real deal. He also told me how much he had paid for it.

I contacted the guy and asked if it was possible to get 3 cards at the same price Phil paid. He declined my offer saying it was now selling at £150 per card to US buyers which was a lot more than I was prepared to pay. He also refused to tell me how many cards he had left answering with "enough".
I suspect that he has sold several of these cards to the dealers who are now splitting it up into smaller lengths.

I would not buy the wool unless it was on the original card. Why, because over the years I've had so much "substitute" passed off as real that I am not confident unless it has all the right packaging.
Also off the card it really has no value to a collector.

It may not make a difference to the fish or the general appearance of the fly but if I tie and sell the flies with the original material at a substantial premium, I cannot afford to rip off a client by accident.

As well as that there is something really nice in using an original material for an old pattern, just ask any of the classic salmon fly tiers.

While it seems that there is a short supply of 477 I suspect that there are a lot of speculators hanging onto cards bought at auctions and club sales for a few pounds in the hope of driving the prices ever upwards.

Evidence of this can be found in the speculative ebay offers.."buy it now" at $1,000 or another at £10 per meter.

So if you are lucky enough to come across a card of genuine Chadwicks 477 darning wool, buy it by all means but don't pay the earth for what should cost you between £30 and £60 . Why the different prices, well there were 2 sizes of card, one with 5 yards of wool and the other larger card with around 12 yards.

Cheers

[spidersplus]

Just to add to Chris's comments - I was originally called by Veniard to say that they had been approached by the gentleman in Hillingdon, wanting to sell them 7 cards of 477.

They (Veniard) did not want to buy but thought I might be interested.

I did buy 3 cards from the man concerned and can confirm that the wool is indeed the real deal.

I would be very vary of the Glasgow Angling offer - I am fairly sure that they are actually selling a sub of 477 - but that is just my own opinion.

I agree with Chris in that I doubt if the fish know the difference between the genuine article and a sub if the pattern is tied well - but I bought 3 cards as I offer Killer Bugs tied with genuine materials and I will not rip off my clients with substitute materials.

Kind regards

[arkle]

Phil, until you put G.A.C's "477" next to a known genuine & original, preferably together under a microscope , perhaps your observations may be a trifle heavy handed.

[ickypimp]

Oh my ... not this one again...

have we not flogged this horse enough, it is accepted that 477 is what sawyer used because it is what he could rob from the wife, it has also been demonstrated that several subs are already freely available that are to all intents and purposes identical

For those that have not ... read this

Material Test - Collecting and Tying Classic Flies - Welcome to the Classic Fly Rod Forum! - The Classic Fly Rod Forum - Message Board - Yuku

I use the niche sub (inspite of having a card of original) it is great stuff at a sensible price and the bugs catch trout...

'Nuff said