Whip Finishing?

[EF DUCK]

Hello All, I am hoping someone can help me here!! when I whip finish, I use a whip finishing tool, and for the most have very few problems, but sometimes, particularly when tying smaller patterns, I get a problem with a tag, which I cannot cut too close as it simply allows the end to slip through and undo
I apply varnish, even a dot of Superglue sometimes, but still have this problem.
I would love to become very neat on tghe finish, so would crave any tips, or even a basic "step by step" on whip finishing with a tool and any tips on tidying my finish!
Many thanks in advance

[Tango51]

1st video lessons

If you pull too tight on the tag end before cutting and the thread is stretched when you cut the thread the tag end will contract and go under the whip. Maybe this is what is causing it to undo, try it with less pressure.

[Highlander]

Other than what Tango51 says I can only assume you are not giving enough turns. You want five at least. & back towards the I bend,have never encountered this problem, very strange indeed. It's the sort of thing one would be better seeing one doing, then easily rectified.
Tight lines

[EF DUCK]

Maybe the number of turns!! I use less on smaller patterns! I shall try some tonight when I get home and report tommorow, Thanks Gents.

[Scratch]

Duck, assuming that you have the basic mechanics of the whip finish sorted, I doubt that you are doing much wrong. I would wager that it's one of two things or more likely a combination.
Firstly,tying is all about tension - the right amount of tension smoothly and constantly applied throughout the tying of the fly. Concentrate on this and your flies will eventaully look better and last longer. You will gain more room to manoeuvre on the hook,flies with loads of 'ingredients' will be a doddle and you will have plenty of room left at the head to concentrate on perfecting the whip finish.
Secondly, it could be your thread. A 'dry' smooth and shiny thread will come undone if the whip finish has relatively few turns and has varying tension applied. When this type of thread is used,always ensure that at least five turns are used ...with good tension.
Once you have got this sorted it's worth moving on to the hand whip finish. One less tool to worry about,quicker,and more importantly,better 'feel' to maintain this tension business I keep bangin on about!

[flylin64]

The advice above about more wraps and less tension on the tag end should solve the problem.

For what it is worth, on small flies (say 18 and smaller), particularly small dries, I generally eschew the whip finish and use one or two double half hitches instead.

You can certainly do half hitches by hand, but one of those cupped, pointed tools that look like pencil-ends will make it faster and more accurate.

[EF DUCK]

Many thanks again for the advice gents, I shall certainly take it on board, and shall maybe try a few bare hook whippings to get it polished off!! I am on nights for the next two nights, so it will be my "red eye" task
Much appreciated

[Alan B]

There is one problem with the whip finish that I never see addressed. Before forming a whip finish ALWAYS untwist your thread! Every time you take a turn of thread around the hook shank (right handed tiers) you add a turn of twist to your thread. By the time you have finished the fly you can have quite a lot of twist in your thread. You then pull tight against "roped up" thread. If you then cut the thread all that twist is realised and your whip finish is no longer tight!

The best way to trim off your thread after forming your whip finish is to make a tiny V with your scissors then hold them tight. Place this V on your thread and slide down to the head, hold the bobbin holder so the thread is under tension, then push. Do not let the scissors open. This way you will trim just the thread and as close as your scissors can get to the whip finish.

If this doesn't sort it come see me at BFFI and I'll go through it with you.

Like Flylin64 says, learn to do it by hand. More control, more feel and no tool to loose. I always say a competent fly tier can choose to do a whip finish with a tool if he sees an advantage in it. If you can't do it with your fingers you can't choose, you are stuck with just one method.

Cheers,
Alan.