I have recently started targetting course species on the fly at a local lake. Its about 3/4 acres and has a good head of carp and rudd. Apparently there are a few perch and chub also in the lake, although I believe these may have only been recently introduced to help control the numbers of small rudd, so the numbers are low.

I have had success targetting the carp on deer hair dog biscuit flies taking a number of fish up to 10lb. Great fun on a 6wt.

In the process I have also picked up a few rudd (yes on size 10 spun deer hair dog biscuit flies) who seem intent on eating anything that is put in front of them.

The carp are great fun and the rudd, although troublesome, do pass the time when the carp are down.

However I have heard that there are some pretty monster rudd in this lake, and would like to target these specimens on the fly. I'm struggling to see of a way to do this without attracting the attentions of the smaller fish, no mouthful seems too big for them.

When the numbers pick up I'd also like to target the chub and perch, so any experiences of targetting these species on a small stillwater would also be appreciated.

Any ideas?

Cheers
Mot

I have had a go at Chub on the river Ouse, with a fair degree of success. They do like gold heads, hairs ears or PTN. I think it's the plop that attracts them.

One guy I met was using dog biscuits for them, but I never had any success with those. Sorry can't be of more help.

__________________
Eddie
"We look to Scotland for all our ideas of civilisation."
Voltaire

Bigger chub are great to stalk in summer - though you need to be exceptionally stealthy. Sight casting to them seems to be the most successful.

As Eddie says, anything with a 'plop' is good. They seem to be greedier and less fussy than trout - so big deer hair sedges, American style foam hoppers and bushy stimulators work well, especially if you can cast them so it appears as if they've dropped off overhanging vegetation.

They do also seem to quite like black lures - I've had a few on black minkies, but they seem to be able to reject subsurface flies extremely quickly.

Later on, as the water gets cooler, I've switched to PTNs etc, but only had success if they're suspended beneath an indicator (usually size 12 para Adams). The takes are fantastically subtle. In mid winter, I lost the plot and really couldn't work out how to get them. That's level 10 ninja fishing, and Skateboard Dave is your man.

I think chub are a vastly underrated fish: they may not have the pizazz of trout, but you need every shred of water craft to get the better ones, and once they do take, hooking them seems a lot harder. They fight dirty too - the favoured tactic seems to be to head for the nearest patch of weed and wrap the leader in it. The key thing is *not letting them see you*. They tend not to bolt like trout, but will slowly melt away, and refuse everything for up to an hour afterward.

Perch I haven't yet figured out. The tiddlers seem to hurl themselves at anything, but only had bigger ones when piking with 7 inch bunnies.

Dace are brilliant fun on ultra light gear (1wt is ideal) and tiny dries - but you have to strike almost as you cast they're so fast.

In general, for all the coarse fish, unless you're deliberately targetting fish attracted by someone else's ground-bait (which makes you rather unpopular), it seems best to steer away from bait imitations - I've never been able to make them work. I have, however, stooped to borrowing maggots and putting them on skinny size 14 buzzers. It works rather well for a cast or two (then they fly off). Just in the spirit of experimentation...

Thanks chaps.

Matt, for some reason chub have always held an appeal for me, although I've only ever caught them on course gear (many years ago). It might be that the numbers are just too small to be able to target them effectively in my little pond but you never know. Perhaps I'll try some big terrestrials as you suggest and see where that gets me.

Still stumped on how to target the bigger rudd, any ideas appreciated

If "your" chub are inclined to show themselves, you might like to try dapping for them. You'll find a way to avoid spooking them I expect, though it may prove tricky. An appropriate bushy fly (or a daddy at the appropriate time) will do, and you may find it is possible to select for chub rather than pesky small rudd - although I have known tiddly little rudd to manage some substantial mouth-fuls! I must admit that most of my still-water dapping has been for trout, but in my youth I used to dap for chub and roach in the Kennet, with conspicuous success. I have to admit that some of my exploits took place in may and june - under the guise of fishing for trout - but the fish didn't seem to know they were out of season. Good luck with the fly-fishing however you go about it; for the Perch you might try streamer flies (about size 6, 3 inches long to start with), perhaps fished on an intermediate or medium sinking line. Oh, and by the way, Richard Walker (who knew a bit about Chub) reckoned that they "came un-scared" at about ten minutes to the pound.