I've seen all the wonderful Snake roll variants, the voodoo's and whatever... They're always demonstrated (online or in videos) by a caster standing in the water with room for a good sized D loop behind them and the anchor just in front of them. Oh and usually into a river with a gentle current and few snags. Honestly even I can look good in those circumstances.

If I'm lucky enough to be in that situation I can put the fly anywhere I want with a roll cast either type of spey or at a pinch a snake roll, but I've a lot of free access to what is pretty difficult water to fish so please good people help me with a cast for the following situation...

• High steep banks so you have to cast down at least 4ft below the soles ofyour shoes before you touch the water.
• Water depth dropping away so unsafe for wading and you have to stay on those high banks.
• Overgrown so there's little room for even the D loop of a rollcast behind you.
• Still-water so you can't rely on the current taking your line out and then simply use a change of direction cast for the next presentation. You're going to have to shoot line each presentation.

Fishing the margins is fine, well sort of fine, I lose flies and do get the occasional tangle but it's a case of stalking, dapping/lowering the line through the brush, snap c/t's etc. but how to get the line out? My rolls in these situations are rubbish. I think it's because I'm so high above the water that I can't get a tight loop rolling out to carry/shoot line and trying to shoot line with such large loops means that turnover is poor which compromises distance anyway.

Trying hauls with roll casts when casting such large loops isn't productive... on the backcast I'd just shoot line into the D loop behind me and risk catching vegetation, on the forward the higher line speed doesn't seem to make much difference to the large loop.

But I confess I am a little confused because longer rods with bigger D loops are supposed to roll better... Maybe it's important that the the rod works the whole of the loop? In which case a 7ft or 9ft rod trying to cast a D loop 11ft or 13ft tall isn't going to be able to cope? Maybe I just can't roll cast well enough... ?

Crouching/sprawling on the bank to lower my height above the anchor seems to help a bit, but not enough. Before I give up and go for a bubble float and a few flies are there any casts that can carry some distance and shoot line while keeping <b>all</b> the line in front of you? A mate suggests something called a Tunnel cast, might this work?

All suggestions welcome.

it would take a week to work all that out

the height above the water shouldnt be a problem for a roll, just put more line in the anchor, fish seeing you might be though, sounds like you need to cast with the Dloop in front of you maybe, hard but maybe possible with the height advantage,
hard to visualise but if the line is moving in a spey cast you already have the momentum to do what you need to change direction and boost the line out, pulling back or rather up slightly on the stop will tighten the line on presentation which is handy for casting down.

a water haul needs an equal amount of anchor to make it worthwhile, just a forward haul right from the stripper ring right at the end of the stroke is a good emergency 'get it out' one, works best with about a rods length of anchor out front for purchase, 4' up you need purchase.

Thanks for the reply.

I think I get what you mean? Use a spey cast to cover different water alternate casts rather than shoot out in a similar direction as I gradually move or "fan" each cast to search the water?

And leave a decent anchor for the roll rather than fish right back to my feet?

When you roll the loop out is there anything you can do to get a tight rolling loop. If I angle the cast down to the water the loop tends to turn over badly at the end as the loop piles into the surface, if I cast along and up to lift the loop/line I end up lifting it the 7ft to my hands plus rod length and trying to lift the line 17ft up in the air takes all the energy from the cast.

Should I be able to overcome either of these problems with better technique?

have a look at this clip especialy the perry poke.

[QUOTE=wrongfoot;937752] I think I get what you mean?


yes, sorry, you actually filled the gaps i forgot to mention, the spey lets you use momentum to do things a static roll cast cant do, like change direction,

im sure just timing the turnover well should give presentation, if the loop is beginning to straighten high enough shouldnt crash, thats maybe tricky if the tradjectory is at a downward angle,
im off to stand on the wardrobe and try it.

Now you know why it's free access. nobody else can be bothered.

Jim

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The Fishermans Friend is the Flirty Fly,Fickle Food for Fleeting Fish.

Wrongfoot,

That is one of the hardest casts in the book. It's possible if you are casting downstream but I would suggest impossible casting upstream. I have a similar cast that I have to do on my local river. It's fine in low water but if the water is a couple of feet up I have to stand on a heavily overgrown bank in front of a tree. If the D loop goes behind it snags up.

First you have to get the line out to the correct distance simply by paying out the line. If the lie is 50 feet away the with the very long anchor (35ft or so) you wont be able to make any significant change in direction. So change direction before you make the cast proper by throwing a couple of long spirals. If you throw the spirals clockwise the line will rise from the water and travel left to right and vice versa.

These spirals will create a little bit of slack line and you can use that to generate enough line speed even with a 35 ft anchor to straighten the line and maybe shoot another 10-15feet. You will have to generate tremendous line speed using a very sharp forward stroke in combination with a powerful haul - and don't let any slack develop. It must be very dynamic or it won't work. As I'm fishing downstream I then throw in the mends I require once the fly has handed.

I hope that makes sense.

Malcolm

I know, and I'll pay for my easy/quality fishing, but for those moments where I want a few hours very near where I live I'll take advantage of this sort of water.

And all the monsters live where it's difficult to fish, because they get left alone... don't they

Hi Wrongfoot,
I think Malcolm is talking about this :


it doesn't look like anything and IMO it won't throw an equal length of line like more traditional spey casts unless you can generate maximum line speed as Malcolm says, but it might be effective for your particular fishing situation.

Regards,
Johan

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Johan Janssens

Hi,

What gear are you using? Specifically what line?

Ta, Lee.